Knowing when to walk away from an argument

walk awayA while ago I saw an article on Facebook which reported that Fr. Bourgeois, a priest who for many years publicly opposed the Catholic teaching of a male-only priesthood, had been dismissed from the Maryknoll Fathers and Brothers.

A friend of mine posted a link on Facebook to the article with the comment “Those bastards in the vatican!!!!”.

My friend has links to the Catholic Church and we have Catholic friends in common, but when I saw the article on his Facebook Timeline I noticed that not a single person had offered a defense of the Church’s actions.

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OSAS & Three Cups of Tea: Cup 3

In the last two blog posts I critiqued the Scripture interpretations of Mack, a commentator on my Once Saved, Always Saved post. Mack had responded to my article, claiming that I had been misapplying Scripture passages to support my argument that it is possible to lose your salvation. If you would like to read my two previous replies, they are available here and here.

We have nearly finished looking at Mack’s commentary, so please pour yourself one last cup of tea and we’ll take a look at the final two passages…

tea

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OSAS & Three Cups of Tea: Cup 2

In the last post I began to examine the responses of Mack, a recent commentator on my Once Saved, Always Saved post who offered some constructive criticism concerning the Scripture passages I presented.

I previously looked at Mack’s commentary of 1 John 5:16-17 and 2 Peter 2:20-22. I will now look at his analysis of several other passages which I offered in defense of the idea that it is possible to lose one’s salvation. Mack basically attempted to disqualify these texts since they were drawn from letters addressed to groups of people.

So, grab another cup of tea and we’ll look at what he had to say…

tea

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OSAS & Three Cups of Tea: Cup 1

I recently had some comments on my Once Saved, Always Saved post by a chap called MackQuigley. In that post I presented several passages as evidence that it is possible to lose one’s salvation. Mack disagreed with my article and said that I had misapplied these passages and that they did not, in fact, support my case.

In his final comment, Mack went through each of the passages I quoted and gave a brief summary of his own interpretation in an attempt to prove that it is not possible to lose one’s salvation. Since he graciously took the time to explain his position and challenged my post in a charitable manner, I would like to return the favour and offer a reply.

I’m going to break up my response into a few different posts, collecting together the passages where Mack used similar argumentation to disqualify the texts. For each passage, I’m going to quote the Scripture under examination, append Mack’s comments and finally offer my own rebuttal.

There are quite a few Scripture passages to address here –  seven in total – so this’ll take a little bit of time. It’s probably a good idea to put on the kettle and brew up a nice cup of tea before we continue…

tea

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Paternal Protestations

As you’ll see from the categorization of this entry, this is an apologetics post. In this article I am going to be defending the use of the writings of the Early Church Fathers in demonstrating the historicity and veracity of the Catholic Faith.

The problem with writing a defence of anything is that, even with the best will in the world, it’s still easy to come across as though you’re attacking those to whom you are responding.

So, if you’re reading this post and you feel that it comes across as Protestant-bashing then I’m truly sorry.  This is certainly not my intention.  In fact, this was one of the reasons why I penned the Ecumenical Apologist entry, to try and dispel such charges. In this post I simply want to present something of an explanation as to why one should care about the Early Church Fathers.

Forgotten Treasure

On the occasions when I’ve been engaged in apologetics with non-Catholic Christians I’ve often mentioned the Early Fathers.  I’m usually met with blank stares.  The Early who?! Unfortunately, like Catholics, our separated brethren haven’t read much of the Early Church Fathers either 🙁

One of my hopes for this blog is that it will encourage both groups to read the Fathers and learn more about our common heritage.  The Early Church Fathers are fundamentally important in ecumenical work since they were living in a time prior to the divisions of the Great East/West Schism and the Reformation.

On the odd occasion when I do encounter non-Catholics who have heard of the Fathers, they usually only have second-hand information and have actually not read any of their writings.  This is not true of all non-Catholics, of course, but in my limited experience it has at least been the larger majority. It should come as no surprise then, upon meeting Catholic or Protestant Christians unfamiliar with the Fathers, I immediately encourage them to begin by reading the letters of my favourite Early Church Father, St. Ignatius of Antioch 🙂

How You Shouldn’t Treat The Fathers

Yesterday, Joe over at Shameless Popery wrote a great post entitled Three Ways You Shouldn’t Treat The Church Fathers. Here were his three points:

Wrong Way #1: Ignoring or Fearing the Church Fathers
Reason: It Reduces Christianity to Incoherence

Wrong Way #2: Exploiting the Church Fathers
Reason: It Doesn’t Treat the Fathers Honestly

Wrong Way #3: Treating the Church Fathers as Infallible
Reason: The Fathers Occasionally Disagree

In this blog post I would like to talk a little bit about the third item. In apologetic exchanges I have often had to correct the non-Catholic assertion that we regard the Fathers as infallible. We don’t. As Joe points out, the Fathers occasionally disagree. It is on this point that I sometimes hear another objection. Here is what someone recently wrote to me:

“The fathers didn’t agree on every matter of doctrine so their opinion is no more reliable than anyone else’s. There were some heated arguments between some of them.  In what way are they different from two modern-day non-Catholic pastors disagreeing over a certain interpretation of the Bible?

I would like to take the rest of this blog entry to address this objection.

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