The Zodiac and The Apostles
One of my friends recently shared a video on Facebook which is an excerpt from the notorious movie Zeitgeist. The narrator in the opening frames rather nicely summarizes its main argument:
“Now, probably the most obvious of all the astrological symbolism around Jesus regards the 12 disciples. They are simply the 12 constellations of the Zodiac, which Jesus, being the Sun, travels about with. In fact, the number 12 is replete throughout the Bible:
12 Tribes of Israel
12 Brothers of Joseph
12 Judges of Israel
12 Great Patriarchs
12 Old Testament Prophets
12 Princes of Israel
Jesus in Temple at 12This text (the Bible) has more to do with astrology than anything else”
Like most things in the Zeitgeist movie, the claims can initially appear convincing until you do a little bit of thinking and a smidgen of research.
Factual Mistakes
As usual, Zeitgeist contains more than a few inaccuracies:
Factual Mistake #1: Joseph had eleven brothers, not twelve. That entry should really read “12 Sons of Jacob”.
Factual Mistake #2: There were not 12 kings of Israel.
Factual Mistake #3: There were far more than twelve Old Testament prophets. If I had to guess, I’d say that the author of the movie is assuming that there were twelve because there is a collection of twelve books in the Bible of the minor prophets. The trouble with this is that it excludes the major ones (Isaiah, Jeremiah, …) as well as the others which are mentioned but who go unnamed.
This does’t exactly fill one with confidence in their scholarly ability.
The Chain of Twelves
The first important factor to note is that the twelves which appear in the Bible can be traced back to one important twelve. The Patriarch Jacob (who is later renamed “Israel”) has twelve sons. These sons produce families, giving rise to twelve tribes, which make up the nation of Israel. Virtually all of the other instances of twelves flow from this.
For example, twelve princes are assembled to administer the affairs, one per tribe. Moses sends twelve spies into Canaan, one representative from each tribe. It is because there were twelve tribes that Jesus chose twelve Apostles to mystically represent Israel.
Jacob arrived first
There is, however, one other very important fact which undermines this entire argument. The birth of Jacob’s twelve sons predate the establishment of the twelve-sign zodiac in c. 500 BC! Since the real Biblical significance of the number twelve can be logically traced back to Jacob, it makes no sense to argue that the Bible stole from an astrological system which hadn’t yet come into existence!
Bam!
…you do know that Babylonians, Egyptians, Sumerians, Assyrians, and more ancient peoples had their own astrologies thousands of years before Christ, right? The ‘wise men’ were likely Chaldean astrologers who were uncannily notorious for their predictions and warnings coming true. Astrology was very real and present during before, during, and after Jesus’ existence on earth.
Oh yeah, and Lucifer? He isn’t mentioned in Genesis. At all. It’s Latin for ‘bringer of light’ and could very likely refer to Venus, which is visible in the east before daybreak.
If you want to have an endless loop of positive reinforcement that”astrology copied Jesus, BAM!”…you should probably not venture online lest you lose any respectable reputation you may find outside of your religious bubble. I found several very interesting articles detailing the accomplishments mankind reached throughout the ages–Jesus was the beginning of the age of Pisces, and we will be entering the age of Aquarius in the next century or so. You should Google it, I think you’d find it interesting.
Hey Ophiuchus, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
Of course, but it’s not the Zodiac mentioned by Zeitgeist.
Can you give some examples of these predictions and your primary sources?
That is not in question.
Lucifer isn’t mentioned in this article, so why are you bringing it up?
I didn’t make that claim anywhere in this article.
Thank you for your answer I know that you are right I wish I knew who you were. Could you if you don’t want to expose who you are could you then give us some material like where to go and find more material like what you have said maybe on YouTube thank you
Since Ophiuchus couldn’t answer my very basic questions, I don’t he can substantiate any of his claims.
Hey there, wanted to chime in on this.
How critically have you examined a mention of anything cosmic in the Bible? It is constantly talking about how God communicates to us with “signs in the sky”… Everyone understood astrology back then, because everyone understood how nature communicates, with wind patterns, with the upward turning of leaves, with moon phases, with meteor showers, with all kinds of natural phenomena that portend omens, regular/cyclical or not…
Do you think every world culture’s rulers has kept astrologers in their inner circle for no reason? You don’t think they are all totally crazy and none of it is actually real, do you? Do you know how many world leaders, how many Wall Street brokers, corporations, celebrities and people are consulting their astrologers? Many more than you may think… Astrology and omenology are very, very real. You just need the eyes to see it! The ancients, including the writers of the Bible know this. I’m sorry to say it but you must learn Greek, Syriac or Aramaic if you want to have a legitimate discussion about what the “Bible” says.
If you want to do more research into actually understanding the ancient mindset before you dismiss Ophiuchus’s claims so broadly, here are some helpful sources:
1) [https://archive.org/details/reportsofmagicia07thomuoft/page/n17/mode/2up]
2) [https://archive.org/details/mesopotamianplan0000brow/page/n7/mode/2up]
3) [https://oracc.museum.upenn.edu/projectlist.html]
I could keep going, you can message me if you want to talk more about this..
You could just answer the questions I asked him.
“And God said, ‘Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to separate the day from the night. And let them be for signs…’” (Genesis 1:14)
Don’t stop there! Finish the verse: “…let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years”
I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING HE SAID IN HIS COMMENT ^^^^^^^
So in your view the world should be in the hands of the Zionists the only Chosen people of God, and the Gentiles should submit to the Rothschilds or die?
Instead of seeing the actual truth that the 12 tribes are the twelve celestial tribes of God the Zodiac and that everyone is invited?
Seems like we don’t have the same understanding of God, yours is the Zionist interpretation and mine is the Universal God that loves and understands all signs, everyone.
Where did I say anything close to that?
It’s historical fact that the Twelve Tribes of Israel predate the twelve-symbol zodiac.
The 12 constellations date back to ancient Sumeria. Thousands of years prior to 500bc. As the bible stories are retelling of older stories and allegories taken from 7 books that also predate the Christian bible by thousands of years. For example Book of the dead, Tibetan book of Life. Doesn’t mean I know what is right or wrong true or false, there are plenty of repeated patterns in nature represented in multiple things over time and they don’t make nature or physical matter any less real. It’s a complex created world made by a creator who knows how he made it and how it works.
Evidence please! 5th Century BC is the earliest I’ve seen.
Joseph did have 12 brothers.
“God remembered Rachel and she gave birth to Ben-Oni” He came after Joseph, his birth resulting in Rachel’s death. His name means “Son of sorrow and resilience “. Jacob renamed him “Ben”, meaning “Of the south and of my right hand”.
Joseph was Virgo, Ben Oni was Leo.
Hey Niels, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
Yes, and this long predated a twelve-member Zodiac.
How do you determine this?