What’s the difference between the feeding of the 4,000 and the 5,000?
The difference is obviously 1,000! However, there’s another importance difference and I’d like to take a look at that today…
In the Gospel last week, we heard Matthew’s account of the feeding of the five thousand. The feeding of the multitudes was clearly important to the Gospel writers since, aside from the Resurrection, it is the only miracle recorded by all four Evangelists.
However, it is important to note that both Matthew and Mark record two different feedings of the multitude. The first feeding is of 5,000 people and the subsequent one is of 4,000:
When it was evening, the disciples came to him and said, “This is a lonely place, and the day is now over; send the crowds away to go into the villages and buy food for themselves.”… taking the five loaves and the two fish he looked up to heaven, and blessed, and broke and gave the loaves to the disciples, and the disciples gave them to the crowds… And those who ate were about five thousand men, besides women and children. – Matthew 14:13-21
Then Jesus called his disciples to him and said, “I have compassion on the crowd, because they have been with me now three days, and have nothing to eat; and I am unwilling to send them away hungry, lest they faint on the way.”… And commanding the crowd to sit down on the ground, he took the seven loaves and the fish, and having given thanks he broke them and gave them to the disciples, and the disciples gave them to the crowds… Those who ate were four thousand men, besides women and children… – Matthew 15:32-39
Why did Matthew and Mark include two miracles of the same kind? After all, if Jesus has already fed 5,000 people, what is really added to the Gospel story by including a second feeding of a smaller number? It seems odd. Wouldn’t it have been better to use that precious ink and parchment to record some different miracle?
Location, location, location…
The feeding of the 4,000 is important because of where it took place. The feeding of the 5,000 took place near Bethsaida, close to the Sea of Galilee. In contrast, the feeding of the 4,000 took place in the region of the Gerasenes, in the region around the Decapolis.
Okay, so the two miracles took place in different regions, so what? It’s important because the first region was Jewish (5,000) and the second region was Gentile (4,000). There are some numerical clues in the text which also point to this distinction (numbers in the Bible are rarely accidental)…
1. Feeding of the 5,000
In this miracle, Jesus takes five loves and feeds five thousand, which is reminiscent of the five books of the Jewish Law (Genesis, Exodus, …). Not only that, but when everyone had finished eating, twelve baskets of left-overs were collected, which was probably alluding to the twelve tribes of Israel.
2. Feeding of the 4,000
In this second miracle, seven loaves are used and seven baskets are collected. The number seven is symbolic of completeness (i.e. not just Jews but Gentiles too) and the number seven is evocative of the seven days of creation when God created all humanity.
So, what is the significance of two feedings of the multitudes? Both miracles show the provision of the Lord, His love for all His people, both Jew and Gentile. In these miracles He feeds them with miraculous bread, in preparation for the day when they would be fed sacramentally by His very own Body and Blood in the Eucharist.
Because there is one bread, we who are many are one body, for we all partake of the one bread
– 1 Corinthians 10:17
so is it 4,000 or 5,000
Hey hermione, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
There were two different feedings on two different occasions to two different groups of people, one Jewish, the other Gentile.
I have had the same revelation of the two and was thinking the seven baskets represented the seven churches in revelations. I am so very blessed to read this and see others who seek God and the knowledge of Him in His word. God bless and keep you all
Both …it is two events in two different places, one to the Jews and one to gentiles.
https://www.levitt.com/essays/feeding4000
Hi! Quick question… Why is it that we hardly hear preachings of the 4,000?
The feeding of 4,000 only appears in two Gospels, so it’s inevitably going to come up less often.
Both… two separate occasions.
Thank you now am enlightened on both events but,where did the 7breads come from to feed 4000???
His disciples brought provisions on their travels (Matthew 14:16)
Both are in the Bible
Thank you for your great explanation!
You’re welcome Kelly, I’m glad it helped 🙂
Where does it say that the feeding of the 4000 took place in the region of the Gerasenes, in the region around the Decapolis
It’s not explicit, but you can see that Jesus goes to that region at the end of Chapter 14 of Matthew. Then, in Matthew 15 we are told that they “passed along the Sea of Galilee”, which is what you’d do to get to the Decapolis. After witnessing Jesus’ miracles they “glorified the God of Israel”, a phrase would make sense if he’s in Gentile territory. Mark’s account of the Feeding of the Four Thousand also indicates a predominantly Gentile audience.
Mark7:31
I agree and also had the same view. I found the clue in Didache book. The feeding is about the gathering of elects around the world. So 12 baskets will mean elects from 12 tribes and 7 baskets from 7 churches in Asia Minor. Bread represents doctrines. Therefore, elects will be gathered by doctrine.
5 loaves can mean 5 books of Moses. 2 fishes are Jews and Lost tribes of Israel (Samaritan half Jew and other lost tribes).
7 loaves is left to ponder (7letters of Ignatius? Nah) but fishes were not numbered since Gentiles are innumerable.
The reason I ask is because in Mark, It starts off by saying ‘In those days’. Yes, in the event leading up to this at the end of Ch7, He was in the Decapolis region when dealing with the man who was deaf and had a speech impediment, but I couldn’t be sure. I am taking an inductive study of Mark and one of the questions was “Where did this take place?” the closest I could come was “beside the Sea of Galilee and he went up on the mountain (Mt 15:29). Thanks for your response.
I think if we coordinate the different Gospel accounts, the case is pretty strong. You might want to check out this article from Jimmy Akin.
Plus I think in Matthew 16:9, Jesus accounts for them being separate events.
Good point!
Don’t go!
Pingback: Day 232-233 (Matt15-18) – Bible in a year – 2017
So what do the 2 fish for the 5000 mean? & the 3 fish for the 4000?
There are a number of different opinions I’ve found among the Early Church Fathers.
Regarding the two fishes…
St. Hilary wrote:
Raban wrote:
Regarding the three fishes…
In a gloss we find the following:
Moses & Elijah are symbolic of the 2 fish 🐟 in the feeding of the 5,000. Also note that on the mount of transfiguration when Jesus needed wise counsel he chose these 2 to consult with; they certainly had their fair share of dealing with people. The 5 loaves are most definitely representative of the Pentateuch (first 5 books 📚 of the Bible & for quite some time the only Bible, which were written by Moses. And I have to ask: How did he know? Since Moses wasn’t around for the creation or the garden or the flood..& the simple answer is: God told him & he wrote it down, word for word.) Remember Jesus said “Man does not live by bread 🥖 alone but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.” (Responding to satan tempting him to turn stones into bread in the wilderness after fasting for 40 days) Jesus literally & figuratively is the word of God made flesh. He is attempting to reveal himself to them & to us, then & today. This Jesus Christ of Nazareth is more complex than we can fathom. His body is real, spiritual food. We spend time in the Word & our spirit grows strong. There is life in the word of truth. Jesus is the way, the truth & the life. No one comes to the father but by him. He is the bread of life; the living water. He that believes on him, though he die yet shall he live.
There are also twelve loaves of showbread in the holy place of the tabernacle/temple. Seven loaves for the 4,000 and five loaves for the 5,000 = twelve loaves. Jesus is the Bread of Heaven.
Hey Rose, welcome to Restless Pilgrim! Seems like a good enough interpretation as any 🙂
First, I only ever knew of the 5000 story, but this explanation of the 2 feedings is great. Do you have an explanation of these words spoken by Christ on the cross? So far, the best explanation came from a Messianic Jew. “God, My God, why have you forsaken me?”
Hey Walter, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
I’m glad you found my article helpful. Regarding Christ’s words from the cross… If I say “Amazing Grace, how sweet the sound that saved a wretch like me…”, you know the song to which I’m referring, together with the subsequent lines and verses. When Jesus offers the lament from the cross, He is quoting Psalm 22. This Psalm prophetically describes the suffering of the Messiah, but His eventual victory and vindication.
My thoughts exactly.
Jesus, from the cross, is still revealing truth to those around him. He was pointing out that Psalms 22 was written about him prophetically & fulfilled in him.
Enjoyed this article
God bless
Hi Cyprian, welcome to Restless Pilgrim! I’m glad you found it helpful 🙂
Any thoughts on why the disciples, having experienced Jesus’ miracle feeding the 5000 in Matthew 14, seem to forget what Jesus could do in Matthew 15 (feeding of the 4000)?
Why did the Israelites complain in the desert after God had miraculously provided for them? We’re forgetful of what God has done for us and quick to complain about everything…
It is almost comical how quickly they forgot! I’m glad I’M not like that😏!!!
To me the disciples did not actually forget as in having a lapse of memory…more they seemed to not be able to discern that if he could feed the 5000 and perform that type of miracle of provision….he could and surely would provide a miracle of protection from the storm. So many will say, “well, yes, I know Jesus healed me of diabetes, however, now I have this need of provision….my mortgage needs to be paid.” The same God provides for all of our needs. HE IS ALL we need. And not just a one time miracle God…or a one miracle per person God. (My thoughts) And I’ve always thought…they didn’t just forget…it was literally they IMMEDIATELY forgot. How human we all can be…thank God for his love.
…rather like when we encounter discomfort our immediate instinct is to just make it stop.
Hi my name is Elizabeth and I just started a Bible study and where in The Book of Mark and your comments are very very helpful I just want to say thank you for explaining the way that you do
Hey Elizabeth,
Welcome to Restless Pilgrim! I’m glad you’ve found this post helpful. If you’re working through Mark, you also might find my Scripture commentary helpful. The notes are very rough, but last time I led a Bible Study through Mark, I tried to jot down some general points of discussion.
God bless!
Wonderful! I never realized this before and how it alludes to certain numbers important to the gospel between the 4000 in the 5000. thank you so much. what a lesson for me today. Joann
Hey Joann, welcome to Restless Pilgrim! Numbers almost always carry some form of significance in the Bible, particularly the New Testament. The Early Church (particularly those influenced by Alexandria) would often comment upon the significance of numbers, particularly Origen of Alexandria.
I don’t understand the reference to the seven loaves relating to the seven says of creation, I thought it was six days of creation and a seventh day of rest. Can you help me here?
Hey Jonah! You’re bringing a twenty-first century mindset to the story. The Creation narrative doesn’t complete until the seventh day, when God blesses and makes the seventh day holy. This is the culmination of all that has come before.
Hi, I found your article on the feeding of the multitude to be very helpful. I stumbled on the site when researching the significance of the type of basket used. They were huge! I feel there is a deeper lesson to be learned from the entire story. I have a question about the 6th day of creation, why did God create animals and man on the same day?
Hey Jamie, welcome to Restless Pilgrim! Is there problem with God creating animals and man on the same day?
At the beginning of the Genesis account, the narrator explains that there are two problems – the earth is “formless” and “void”. Over the course of the narrative, both of these problems are solved, first the formlessness and then the void.
On the first three days, God creates environments, thereby adding form. He then spends the following three days populating these regions, thereby filling the void. Light and dark are “populated” with the sun, moon and stars. The seas and the air are populated with fish and birds, respectively. Finally, the land is populated with animals. Man is, after all, an animal, but a special kind of animal, gifted with an immortal soul.
Many thanks for your explanations to ‘the two separate feedings’
Your analysis with the numbers are clear and it’s helped me in my studies in scriptures.
Thanks .
Hey Alex, welcome to Restless Pilgrim. I’m glad it’s helped!
I love your description of these two feasts. I’m glad I found your site. I’ll be sharing some insights at a women’s retreat on “trust,” particularly about God’s provision and love for *all* people. Thank you, and keep up the kind and beautiful work.
Thanks 🙂
If you’re talking on trust, you might like to read this article I wrote about what Jesus meant when he said we were to become like little children…
Years later, I see this message, Pilgrim. I hope you’re well! I’d stay in touch by email, if you like. Take good care, Tryn Rose / trynrose@gmail.com
Thank you! Loved this article.
You’re welcome! Glad it helped 🙂
It’s really educational to know the reasons why there’s a differing between the feeding of the 4000 and the 5000 I have just read it to two of my grandchildren who wanted to know how it was done and I LOVE the word of GOD and being able to explain the reasons why JESUS was able to do these miracles because of his father in heaven
Hey Robin, welcome to RestlessPilgrim! Glad I could help 🙂
What a beautiful analysis. Thank you.
You’re welcome!
This is helpful as I used to think it was not as significant to not where they were fed, but rather that they were fed.
Hey Eugene, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
It is important that the hungry were fed, and by the hand of Jesus thus providing a sign to His divinity. However, the location of those feedings *does* reveal something significant about His mission.
Great comments. Interesting info re location, and numerology.
Thanks!
Very powerful revelation. God bless you for sharing.
I’m glad it helped 🙂
The 5000 (jews) sat on green grass
The 4000( Gentiles or church) sat on Ground
I never thought about Jesus feeding the multatude twice
What’s the Jewish tradition and significance in feeding the men first ?
Hey there! Welcome to Restless Pilgrim! I don’t really see anything in the text that implies that the men actually ate first. Rather, it’s just that the crowd estimation followed the cultural convention of the time of counting it in terms of men.
Matthew 15:33 New International Version (NIV)
33 His disciples answered, “Where could we get enough bread in this remote place to feed such a crowd?”
My question is why the disciples were astonished and wondering how he will feed the 4000 while he jesus already done the same miracle befor for a greater number by God’s will.
Hey Mostafa, welcome to Restless Pilgrim! Regarding your question, I’m going with “You unbelieving and perverse generation… How long shall I put up with you?” 😉
I came here to ask the exact same question. Your answer does not suffice. If Jesus had performed this before there was no reason they should wonder what he might do to feed a large group again. That kind of thing kind of stands out. And if they forgot, would not Jesus have said, “where were you when I fed the four thousand, are you so quick to forget?”
I mean if you read Marks accounts of the two it sounds like the disciples had total amnesia.
Jesus would have pointed that out. We have to remember these were gathered from accounts by witnesses many years later.
If Jesus had performed this before there was no reason they should wonder what he might do to feed a large group again
The disbelief of the Apostles is a constant motif of the New Testament. Just consider the Passion narrative itself – despite everything they had seen Him do they fled as soon as He was arrested.
“Jesus would have pointed that out”
Maybe He did, maybe He didn’t, but the purpose of the Gospels is not to be a black box recording or even a comprehensive account (as John points out in his own Gospel).
“We have to remember these were gathered from accounts by witnesses many years later.”
It’s not like the first time this story was retold was years later. These parables were part of the Apostolic preaching since Pentecost.
Well you should know that Jesus was here about 18 months in his ministry at the time of feeding of the 4000. FIRST ! How would you like to have been the disciples .? They were Jewish men who trusted in our saviour. At this time in their culture they were not suppose to go the gaterenes Jewish law ! they were not to go to caves. They did not have a good trip.One the boat which was on a forbidden side of the Galilee was know to be evil.But Jesus who knew all things knew what was waiting for them. Also in their culture you were not to look on a naked person. As they arrived they were greeted by a naked demon possessed man with a legion of demons which Christ removed. He wanted to stay with him but was sent to tell all that was done for him. The witness of this man caused the four thousand to come to him when he returned.Jesus was the one who they wanted to see and that is the rest of the story of the feeding of the four thousand. You have know the culture to get the stories.Read your history. It is all true good thing you were not there to judge them. E Jackson.
I found it comforting that Jesus chose not to rebuke them in this particular instance. I pictured him quietly chuckling to himself..maybe even rolling his eyes a bit but in my mind this demonstrates his infinite patience and love towards them.
Very interesting how certain scripture correlates with the scripture of miracles. I didn’t know that there really was two different merciless revering to loaves and fishes. I just thought people got it mixed up all the time when I heard anything but 5 loaves and 2 fishes with 12 remaining leftovers. So the 5000 was with the Jews, and the feeding of 4000 was with the Gentiles. The gentiles had 7 loaves and 7 baskets left over but how many fish, I think I missed that?
Two fish are referred to in the Feeding of the Five Thousand. Neither Matthew nor Mark refer to the number of fish in the Feeding of the Four Thousand (“few small fish”)
Very interesting – what about the 153 large fish that Peter caught after Jesus’ resurrection
St. Augustine loved to talk about the meaning of this number: “Mystically, in the draught of fishes He signified the mystery of the Church, a such as it will be at the final resurrection of the dead…It is not then signified that only a hundred and fifty-three saints are to rise again to eternal life, but this number represents all who partake of the grace of the Holy Spirit. which number too contains three fifties, and three over, with reference to the mystery of the Trinity. And the number fifty is made up of seven sevens, and one in addition, signifying that those sevens are one. That they were great fishes too, is not without meaning. For when our Lord says, I came not to destroy the law, but to fulfill, by giving, that is, the Holy Spirit through Whom the law can be fulfilled, He says almost immediately after, Whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of hearer. In the first draught the net was broken, to signify schisms; but here to show that in that perfect peace of the blessed there would be no schisms, the Evangelist continues: And for all they were so great, yet was not the net broken; as if alluding to the case before, in which it was broken, and making a favorable comparison.”
Another comparison of the number seven in the second feeding might be the seven churches listed in Revelation.
I think they’re both seven for the same reason – a sign of covenant and completeness.
Just what i was thinking
Do you think some of the Jews ate with the gentiles of the 4000.
Well, at a minimum we have Jesus and the Apostles also there, so I’d say “Yes”
The two fish mentioned in the feeding of the 5000 could it be refering to Moses rescued from the water by the daughter of the king representing the terbanacle & Peter a fisherman rescued from the water by Jesus the king representing the church.
The seven baskets in the feeding of the 4000 could it be the 7 gentile nations
I hadn’t thought of either of those – nice 🙂
So why did the disciples forget the feeding of the 5,000 in Matthew before Jesus did the same miracle by feeding the 4,000 near the Decapolis? Did they have holy amnesia?
It’s a repeated pattern in the Gospels – the Apostles are a bit thick.
Pilgrim your interpretation is as absurd as the illustration. Did the disciples really carry large empty baskets around with them waiting for the right number of people to turn up in the appointed places? Why did they not eat all the bread? Who counted all the people? Who at the time understood the interpretation you are giving it?
Surely Jesus showed reluctance about including Gentiles when he told the woman that “it was not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs!” Mtt.15, 26
Hey Ismith977, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
I’m not entirely sure to what illustration you’re referring, but I’ll see if I can answer your questions…
The text itself doesn’t give us an answer to this question, but we can make some educated guesses. Is it possible each disciple had a basket, much like a backpack, in which they carried their own supplies as they went around with their itinerant Rabbi? It’s possible. After three days such baskets would likely be near empty. I think the probability of the presence of such baskets is dramatically improved when you add four or five thousand other people (not even including women and children).
This answer is in the text. They’d had enough to eat:
And they all ate and were satisfied – Matthew 14:20
And they all ate and were satisfied – Matthew 15:37
It seems to me to be quite a common thing, when at any large event, for many people present to estimate the number of people there. Mark’s Gospel offers us a clue as to how the mathematics could have been simplified:
Then he commanded them all to sit down by companies upon the green grass. 40 So they sat down in groups, by hundreds and by fifties – Mark 6:39-40
At that precise moment, it’s hard to say (the Apostles often missed the point), but you find this idea among the earliest extant interpretations of the Scripture, in the writings of the Early Church Fathers.
Only if you assume ignorance on the part of Jesus and reject the idea that this incident was a teaching moment for his disciples, preparing the way to his feeding the Gentiles a few verses later.
I’d be interested in your own explanation of these Gospel episodes.
In fact I am learning new revelations, more grace to you all as we make this world a better place by nurturing the unlearned with the word of God. God bless you all
Thanks a lot for this insightful article! I am a little troubled here though… it seems that Biblical authors used lots of symbols and numerology in their writings – does this mean they “engineered” numbers in this case just to convey the significance of the miracles and not to convey facts? Maybe there were only 3429 men but the evangelists rounded it to 5000 in order fit their purpose – how then can we trust the Bible?
Hey David, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
To begin with, Matthew doesn’t give us an exact head count. He says that it was “about five thousand men”, and even this didn’t include women and children. There could have been a few hundred more or less. The point that he thought was significant was that it was about 5,000 and it took place in Jewish territory.
I think you’ve got to be careful not to read the Gospel texts with extreme literalism. The Gospels are of the genre of Greco-Roman biographies and are therefore subject to a number of conventions and allowances such as telescoping and spotlighting. The authors are trying to make theological points, as well as reporting what happened.
More importantly though, if this Jesus is the God who made the entire cosmos, who has just multiplied a few loaves to feed a huge crowd, is it really that difficult for him to engineer it so that the number of men at this miracle was about 5,000?
Hi
Biblical authors used lots of symbols and numerology in their writings – does this mean they “engineered” numbers in this case just to convey the significance of the miracles and not to convey facts?
my comment: If you look at the meaning of Bible symbolism it shows the original meaning has a numeric label for the interest of readers who trust Jesus rule that the scripture cannot be broken Jn 10:35, one example of this is the 42 months rev 11: rev13: 5 which carry’s the same blasphemy meaning as in 2K 2: 23,24, 2K 10:14, Jdg 12:6 which is one example of how the gospel records are confirmed in the OT as one whole truth.
How much time passed between Jesus hearing of John the Baptist beheading and feeding of 5000? How much time between the feeding of 5000 and the feeding of 4000?
I don’t think the text gives us answers to those questions.
Ok. Thanks
I don’t believe either feeding took place. The fact that it is recorded in all four gospels doesn’t lend any credibility since both Luke and Matthew copied extensively from Mark (over 50%). Yeah, it’s in John – so what? He only knows about it through hear-say and the book of John was written by committee sometime in the first century (do your homework).
Even more telling, no where other than the bible is there any mention of these two monumental events and miracles. Many were recording history in those times. Do you really think they would have overlooked something so miraculous? Four thousand, five thousand people gathered in one place? Pretty hard not to notice and join in on and report about. Remember, we’re talking about areas where the population was nothing like it is today. Fouor thousand, five thousand people would have represented a large percentage of the entire population. And no one noticed or recorded it but the the writers of the bible?
Maybe it didn’t happen.
Would more attestations really matter to you? How many would you need to make you believe this actually happened?
As for other historians recording events, I remember the time when we were told that Pontius Pilate never existed because we only found mention of him in the Bible. However, once again archeology vindicated the Biblical account.
John 20 vs 30,31 – tells us about the purpose of the Book .. there were many other signs and wonders that were done in the prescence of the disciples , which are not written in the book… there are written in the book so that you May believe that Jesus is Christ the son of God.. and that by believing you have Life ( Eternal life ) in His Name … God Bless.
Thank you….love diving deeper into His word.
Hi. My name is Phile Samuel .. Just wanted to share what i received as a revelation with you guys here in this page.. Jesus in the space of 2 chapters in the Gospels – shared 2 miracles of different Magnitude ( 5000 +4000) – with different numbers in the Miracle.. I will be sharing this with my church this week and thought if this benefits anyone else around the world May God Bless you with this..
1. 7 Loaves used to feed 4000 – Returned back 7 baskets full of Loaves –
while only 5 Loaves were used to feed a bigger number ( 5000+) /multitude and bigger leftovers 12 basket full of leftovers were taken back by the disciples ..
Have we ever wondered why Jesus did the same sort of Miracle with his disciples and at 2 different situations with different proportions of Loaves of bread… Jesus said (John 6 vs 35 ) i am the Bread of life and he who comes to me will never hunger … Jesus always meant about the spiritual hunger / feeding the Spiritual man.
Many a times we as Christians are wanting to know what we get back in return to serving God … even His disciples had asked Jesus if they could sit at the right hand and the left in the Kingdome.. ( mat 20 v 20 -28 )
Summarising the Miracle of feeding the 4000 & 5000 –
1. it does not matter how much loaves you have .. what Jesus wanted is if you could serve others with the Spiritual Manna with what you have – Lives will be Blessed / Transformed / satisfied in Jesus Name ..
2. Your serving the people with what you have – will lead to your Spiritual blessings …5 Loaves – fed a bigger number of people (5000+) than 7 loaves (4000 +) and thus the bigger number of people you serve leads to a bigger spiritual blessings in return ( 5000 + people returned back 12 baskets full of leftovers ) – than 4000 + people.. ( 7 baskets full )
3. Remember Mat 20 vs 28 – Jesus said the Son of Man came to serve and not to be served.. to give his life as a Ransom for many.. let us also have the same attitude of Serving Jesus and serving others with the Living Manna…
Mat 28 vs 19,20 says go and make disciples and teach them the living word to observe what has been commanded.
Let us take this oppurtunity – to serve others with the Living Manna – the bigger the magnitude of people served the bigger the returns of the Spiritual blessings God has in store for us.
Compare the 7 baskets vs the 12 baskets returned back after the miracle- Returns increased (1.75 times to 2.4 times per thousand )
Your God will reward you when you Labour for the Lord.. Its written in the Bible God will reward those who work for God Almighty.. God Bless you all…
Amen bless you
According to my research, the SIZE of the baskets in the feeding of 5,000 were smaller, shopping baskets which may have had a handle to be carried on one arm. The Greek word for the size of the 7 baskets (and I don’t have the precise word at my fingertips right now) is for a distinctly different size of basket. Much larger. The type of basket in which the Apostle Paul was placed and lowered over the wall to escape the city. Therefore, the 7 baskets actually contained MUCH more leftover bread than the 12 smaller baskets.
I believe the feeding of the 5,000 Jews represents God’s OT revelation of Himself to the Jews through Moses and Elijah (2 fish) and the 5 Books of Moses (5 loaves) (inferior grain — barley).
I believe the feeding of the 4,000 represents God’s further, more complete revelation of Himself in Jesus Christ who came to save not just the Jews, but also the Gentiles (See Ephesians – “one new man”) The 7 loaves of bread made with superior grain (flour) represent the 7 churches. The seven large baskets of leftovers represents the general concept of completeness — but also extreme abundance given the size of the baskets.
Both stories taken together add up to 12 loaves of bread OT + NT for all of mankind. The Gospel provides salvation through Jesus Christ sufficient for both Jews and Gentiles.
And what I find very interesting is this. Jesus wen’t to the Decapolis at an earlier time and that’s where the whole sine event happened, and they drove Jesus away. Jesus said to the now free demoniac who begged to go with Jesus to go and tell the Decapolis what The Lord had done for him. When Jesus returned they were waiting on the shores to greet him, and He fed the 4000, plus women and children. There could have been 50 thousand or a million people there. Ephesus is mentioned in Revelation, the second largest city in the Decapolis had a population of 250,000 at the time of Christ. It’s very interesting. So many converted through on man the ‘demoniac’. (or 2 in another Gospel).
Great article. Thank you. FYI as I was searching this particular miracle I came across your article but it was on another website and someone else has taken credit for it.
https://www.somersethillsbc.org/shbc-blog/whats-the-difference-between-the-feeding-of-the-4000-and-the-5000/
Thanks for the heads-up!
Thank you so much…
Well it does not matter who takes the credit .. Let God’s will be done.
Thank you for your encouragement ..
Why women and children not count?
It’s not that they don’t count (as in have no worth). It’s simply that they weren’t included in the estimate – this was pretty typical for ancient cultures at the time.
I think truthsayer need to figure out how true the Bible is . Just did a study on archaeological finds in Israel
The study is call Bible Unearthed . It is amazing what they have found . The Bible is so true and I believe all of it . Not many people are qualify to interpret the Bible
Who is ultimately qualified to interpret the Bible?
Just a small point The creation week was 6 days not seven. He rested on the seventh day and rested. He did no creating on that day.
Hey Paul,
Welcome to RestlessPilgrim.net!
While it’s true that nothing was created on the seventh day, it is still part of the creation account and I would argue that the Sabbath rest is an integral part of the cosmos’ creation, crowning the Lord’s work.
God bless,
David.
I think It’s okay to go in-depth in the scriptures, but The lord is still in control of everything. The lord uses the scriptures to reveal what he wants to reveal to each person individually as that person is made ready to receive, or where that person is in their spiritual walk in life, because every person has a different path or a different story that needs to be addressed, and so the lord uses the scriptures to meet each person on the level where they are on and to treat the need of that person. because they are levels. And the big thing here is to really understand that there is a God that created this earth and that he also created human beings and that we’re all need to get to know him. because at the end of the day we’re going to need him. The ones who say they don’t believe this and that is still in the understanding that there is a God, and they are searching for him, but they are searching in all the wrong places, because God can only be found in the heart. So before looking anywhere else start searching the heart to see if you have thrown him out or if you still have him there. Then start talking to him and he will direct your path. and the scriptures will then become more understanding as God uses them to address all of your questions and needs. God Bless! I came upon this website while asking siri about the loaves and fish how many it was. I didn’t even realize that there were two different times of the feeding of the multitudes. I was interesting to read. God meets people where they are in life and he starts from there and everything else falls in line. precept upon precept line up line. The important thing is to look to him for everything.
I love that insight Annette, gentle and loving, and inclusive, for His love is open to all, not just the intellectual or supposed ‘open minded”, but to all who genuinely search for Him, which as you say, can only come from a heart driven will to do so.
Greetings Restlesspilgrim,
Indeed the God of Israel is a God of wisdom, all knowing and he is everywhere.
I stumble upon this article many years after you wrote it and it is still as refreshing as new. Indeed the word of God is strength to our bones.
With regards to the two miracles, I like the way you have explained and indeed if I should add anything it should be:
1. Jesus being the word and in this instance the bread of life, is sent among the people of the earth first to the Jews then the nations of the world are blessed in extension.
a.The bread in this case is sent to work, to feed and satisfy and fill the thirst and hunger and in return brings abundance in form of the 12 full baskets. *Mark this, the baskets are full.
b. When the word reaches the nations, it also works and in harvest brings forth 7 full baskets.
All these I am inspired by the word of God that my Word does not go and come back to me in vain but is sure to accomplish every work it was desired to accomplish.
2. I pray that we continuously strive to submit to God, t and allow his word (Jesus) and be ready and willing to be used to help bring this knowledge of God to many people who have not had an encounter with the knowledge, peace,joy and wisdom that is the word of God.
I would also like anyone to add or enlighten me more about what I have shared as we all strive to be know God more and more.
(Remember it is written,’ My people perish because of lack of knowledge’ the knowledge of God.)
May the peace of our Lord and Savior Christ be with you all.
Regards,
Anaclate
Amen!
Thanks a lot, it helped my daughter with her school work. it’s good to see people taking part to interpret God’s word. Thanx a lot
You’re welcome 🙂
It feels great to be on this site. It has really helped me a lot. Thanks guys.
The 7 loaves is the days of creation and rest and the 3 fishes, the Father, Son and Holy Ghost who are one
The 5 loaves are the five books of law (Torah) and the Two fishes, the 2 covenant (Old and New or Law and Grace)
The trouble with allegorical readings of Scripture is that it’s easy to come up with something not intended by the author, particularly when it comes to numbers, which is why it’s best to root it in the literal meaning of the text.
I think some allegorical readings are easier to defend than others, such as if there’s a a clear literary allusion and also if you find that allegorical interpretation in the Early Church Fathers.
Hello, the author is ultimately our Higher Power, and the meaning is revealed to all according to their need and point of journey in life. It’s not and never was meant to have one meaning. The only goal is to draw all in a closer relationship with God.
It’s just another weary lockdown Sunday here in Scotland and I was on a quest for spiritual ‘food’ as I researched the Eucharist and how Jesus was always feeding people – even after His physical death. I’m delighted to have happened upon your blog and I intend to stick around for the buffet – lots of good stuff here – bless you! Shalom.🙏😇🛐
You’re very welcome 🙂
If you enjoyed this, you might want to check out our podcast, “Pints With Jack”, where we unpack the works of C.S. Lewis.
Thank you for your elaborate explanation sir. In your explanation you said creation was done in 7days but scripture in genesis 1v31 said it’s 6 days and God rested the 7th day. Nothing was done on the 7th day . That is the sabbath day.
Hey Horace,
Just because nothing was made on the seventh day, doesn’t mean that the Sabbath isn’t a crucial part of the creation account. You can regard it as six days + Sabbath if you like, but I think it’s simpler just to call it seven days.
Cheers,
David
What is interesting is that when Jesus had gone to Gerasenes the first time where the story of the demoniac who he healed, sending the demons into pigs is told,the residents there had not welcomed Jesus.. they had asked him to leave. The man who was healed wanted to go with Jesus but Jesus told him to go back to his town instead and speak of what God had done. How amazing to note that the time Jesus returns, there are large crowds following him (when he feeds the 4000). I imagine that the testimony of the man healed from demons really stirred up people’s belief or curiosity about Jesus.
Pingback: Week 22 – 23 May 2021, Gospel Parallels and Periscopes – youf class
I literally just wrote a blog about this and came across yours. I am amazed that the two feedings together have such signficance and can’t believe that for years my church always just dismissed any coincidental comparison of the two. https://gracepowered307890876.wordpress.com/2021/05/26/feeding-the-five-thousand/
Hey Jen, I hope my post was helpful 🙂
Which of them give thanks for the food? The 5000 or 4000 with bible text please thank you
I’m not sure what you mean. Jesus gives thanks in both situations (“blessed”…”having given thanks”).
Woow I had started argument with my learner’s thanks so much saved a day
It is all good 👍
Praise the Lord!!!. This past Sunday the Pastor preached from this story in Matthew. During the week, I like to read the chapter that was the basis of Sunday morning sermon. After reading Matthew14 I went on to read Matthew 15. This caused me to dig deeper into the subject, which led me your article on the two feedings. I want to say I really enjoyed reading your article and all of the informative comments. May God continue to bless you 😀
I wonder if you’ve had a chance to read the article linked by “Joe” a couple of years ago arguing that it’s unlikely that Jesus was preaching to Gentiles in the second feeding? https://www.levitt.com/essays/feeding4000
Not sure what to think as I don’t know much about ancient geography/demography!
I had a look – seems to contradict what I’ve read on the subject and seemed to have an axe to grind.
I, too, just read the levitt.com article, and the referenced verses of Matthew 10:6 (Jesus’ instruction to His apostles), and Matthew 15:24 (Jesus’ statement to the Canaanite woman) state to whom He wanted His apostles to reach, and the reason He was “sent”: the Jews. This reinforces the author’s argument that the feeding of the 4000 was not an outreach to Gentiles.
Not really – this is a minority view, both in terms of demographics and interpretation, assuming that the early apostolic missions were to be the standard for all time, and misinterpreting the incident with the Canaanite woman, and ignoring other passages such as the Great Commission.
My understanding is that the Jewish people would have read/heard these gospel accounts and the symbolism in the numbers would have leapt off the scroll to them! You mentioned the 5 books of Moses, but the 2 fish would have represented the 2 tablets Moses inscribed the 10 Commandments on (as this is what the number 2 often represented for the Israelites). They would have also likely picked up on the idea that Jesus was telling his disciples that he would be giving them the “complete law” (5 books of Moses + 2 tablets of commandments) & that there would be MORE than enough for ALL of “God’s people” (12 basketfuls left over, representing the 12 tribes).
Interestingly, Luke adds that Jesus had the disciples seat the into groups of 50, and Mark adds something similar, “(40) So they sat down in groups of hundreds and fifties.” This may have conjured up in their minds the account of Moses doing that very thing back in Exodus (18:17-26), which may have communicated to the disciples that they were capable of partnering w/ him to bring the kingdom of God (ie. Moses was grouping the people so he could delegate leadership to each group & stop trying to manage the entire nation himself).
Matthew & Mark likely included the account of feeding 4,000 at the Decapolis in order to show Jesus’ heart for the “other.” It was unlikely an accident that neither of them include the number of fish — these were pagan/gentile folks who were not bound by Torah. And, although the number 7 represented completeness to the Israelites/Jewish people, they also understood it to mean the 7 pagan nations (listed in Joshua 3:10). This second account was Jesus showing His disciples that not only was He enough for the Jewish people (which he’d just communicated through feeding the 5,000), He was enough for the Gentiles/ALL people.
Blessings
The 5 breads represents the Torah and the 2 fish Ephraim and Manasseh. When Jacob blesses Ephraim and Manasseh he says they will be fisherman of men. Sadly, the translation from Hebrew to English does not say this. That’s why it’s important to learn the holy language and read the scriptures in its original language. God bless you all
In what verse does it describe them as fisherman of men?
The Old Testament foreshadowing of “fishers of men” which I’d point to is Jeremiah 16:14-16.
Really enjoying this article and comments. Probably this has already been mentioned but I wonder if part of the disciples’ unbelief at the feeding of the 4000 was that they wouldn’t be thinking Jesus had come for the Gentiles too, to the extent of bringing them the same miracle. I think another moment worth bringing in is the Gentile woman coming to Jesus and suggesting that even crumbs under the table would be enough for her! There is enough Jesus to go round! The leftovers gathered at the feeding of the 4000 and 5000 were crumbs, on one level, abundance on another. Jesus came ‘to the Jew first’ but everyone wins. Oh the kindness (hesed) of G-d.
Hey Ruththecleaner, welcome to Restless Pilgrim!
Thanks!
I don’t think it was mentioned, but that’s a fantastic connection!
Thank you for this insights. When Jesus asked the disciples the meaning of their feeding of 5000 and 4000, it was left hanging.
We owe this to early disciples in leaving us some clues. I found one in the book of Didache. The feeding in the mountain refers to the gathering of the elects.
Now I can see the fulfillment of the prophecy that the spirit of Elijah is already at work… Turning the hearts of the children to the fathers, i.e. turning us modern elects to the doctrines of the fathers.
We can never find these teachings like yours in mainstream christian churches.
May God continue to guide you, being Elects scattered abroad.
Hello. Can you give any reason why it is not included in Luke?
A Muslim I am in dialogue with is trying to use this as a claim against its authenticity.
Thank you for this article. Very insightful and still inspiring comments and questions years later, including mine.
God bless.
Steve.
Because that Evangelist didn’t deem it crucial, it’s as simple as that.
I’d first of all ask him why Luke’s omission hurts authenticity. Does it hurt the authenticity of Luke (“He was ignorant!”) or Matthew (“He was making stuff up!”)?
I often find that skeptics set an impossible standard – they demand that every Gospel include every event, but when multiple Gospels contain the event there are claims of plgariaism and collusion.
By the time of Muhammad the Christian Bible had both of these and the Qur’an affirms the inspiration and preservation of the Christian scriptures of Muhammad’s time, so really he’s denying the Qur’an if he thinks they’re inauthentic.