Atheistic Iceland Meme
My, there are a lot of atheism memes being posted on Facebook at the moment! Here’s one a friend recently posted:
My first reaction to this meme is one of puzzlement. As is often the case with memes like this, it makes a straw man argument. Do theists really say that it’s impossible for atheists to do good deeds? Do we really say that countries with an atheist majority will always be hell-on-earth? Personally, I’ve certainly never made that case!
I’m not 100% certain, but I’d guess that the faulty idea behind this meme comes from a misunderstanding of the Moral Argument for God’s existence. However, the Moral Argument does bring up an interesting question for the creator of this meme. Without an objective, external Moral Law (i.e. God) who is to say what counts as “evil and depravity”?
I do also query some of the examples it gives at the top of the meme. Consider the first statement that “Iceland has no standing army”. While it is true that Iceland does not have a standing army, it still has a Coast Guard and various Special Forces Units. Not only that, there there are agreements with NATO and the United States to protect Iceland in case of hostilities. Putting these omissions aside, however, is the meme really suggesting that the absence of an army flows from being an atheistic society? Is the meme saying that armies are, in and of themselves, “evil and [depraved]”? Is there never a good reason to go to war?
Another point it makes is that “the economy is booming”. Despite the fact that this is a rather rose-tinted view of the state of Icelandic economics, what exactly is the argument being made here? Is it saying that weak economies are “evil and [depraved]”? Or is the meme crediting Iceland’s economy to atheism?
The other thing this meme ignores is that Iceland is an extremely homogeneous population, and it’s well known that homogeneous populations will have reduced social ills because the population generally shares the same values.
There is, however, a key problem with this meme…it’s not true. The CIA “World Factbook” outlines the religious breakdown of the country as follows:
Evangelical Lutheran Church of Iceland 73.8%
Roman Catholic 3.6%
Reykjavik Free Church 2.9%
Hafnarfjorour Free Church 2%
The Independent Congregation 1%
Other religions 3.9%
None 5.6%
Other or unspecified 7.2% (2015 est.)
So “Atheist majority population”? I don’t think so.
Great response, RP. I do want to point out that there is a stream of Protestantism, mostly among the fundamentalists, that is guilty of teaching that atheists in general have no morals and have no reason to behave like decent citizens. It is to this crowd that the meme must be directed.
Fair enough, but that’s also the same crowd who have problems with science, any Bible translation other than the KJV, … Why bother posting a meme against them on the Internet? The group is so tiny you could practically mail them each the meme on a postcard 😉
I can’t remember where you live, RP, but let me guess that you don’t live in the southwest USA. You are also Catholic. The Southern Baptists are the second largest religious group in the US behind the Catholics. They are nowhere near as tiny as you think. They are no longer the “moral majority,” but there are still a lot of them. Not all Southern Baptists are fundies, and not all are far right, but I’d guess half of them are. The next largest denomination is the Assembly of God, with about 6 million members. I’d guess again that half of them are radically right wing and fundamentalists. It’s tens of millions of people, a bit more than you might want to reach with a postcard.
I live among the heathens in the Pacific Northwest 🙂
But would all of them really assert that atheists can’t do anything good? I’ve only ever met a very small handful of people on the Internet that would go that far. I’ve known more who would say that atheists can’t do good works pleasing to God, but not very few who would assert that to be atheist means to be completely ignorant of the Moral Law.
If I were an atheist, and I had the experience with Christians and what they say that I really do have, I would post a meme like that if I saw it, and I would think that I was talking to a lot of Christians. The people I have experience with over the last 30 years would not let themselves be pinned down to “atheist means to be completely ignorant of the Moral Law,” but their general arguments against atheism–made to me as a Christian about atheists rather than directly to atheists–would leave me to believe that atheists are “totally depraved.” I would conclude, based on what I heard, that Christians think it is impossible for atheists to build a moral society. I would conclude that Christians think that atheists are going to commit all the easy sins more than theists would. In other words, they would have no reason to control their urges other than fear. Thus, they would fornicate like animals, shoplift anywhere that it was easy, cheat on their taxes, pilfer in the workplace, and they would do that almost across the board with rare exceptions.
I think the difference is the circles we have traveled in. The fact is, unless you are attaching Catholicism, Catholics are much more gracious than fundamentalists are toward outsiders. Fundamentalists are not as rare as you think they are. I have managed to stay in touch with hundreds and thousands of them everywhere I have lived as a Christian–Germany, California, Texas, Tennessee–I have had no problems finding people who are fundamental enough to have a problem with science.
I saw a meme once with a picure of Obama. It said, “I don’t talk about gun control much, but when I do … gun sales soar.” That’s true. You know those people that got in Chick-Fil-A lines all the way around the block? Yeah, most of them think scientists are part of a conspiracy.
Beware! One of them may be your next-door neighbor!
But that’s a lot more unlikely on the Left Coast, I admit. 😀
I haven’t really visited the southwest yet, but I’m planning on doing it later this year. I’ll have to make sure I read up on my Jack Chick tracts in advance 🙂
Lol
I should add that I agree the KJV-only crowd is now rather small, as you suggest. The anti-evolution crowd has not shrunk much, though. It’s still normal for the more fundamentalist denominations (Most Baptists and all Pentecostals, including A of G) to be almost purely anti-evolution.
Ah yes, Statements of Faith that revolve around the rejection of evolution and the NIV, rather than faith in Christ 🙂
Atheism always cracks me up a little. If you truly have no belief in something, then why try to convince others who do believe that they are wrong? Does your lack of belief not then somehow itself become a belief that you are now trying to impose on others? That same thorn you accuse believers of sticking you with? (Ex: My belief is that there is no God.) They now have a demonstrated belief. And one definition of religion is: a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance. So therefore, not only do you have a belief, but you now also have a religion. It just happens to be a religion in which there is no God. I can easily see understand the disillusionment with Christianity and religion as a whole. Many so called Christians do not often put their best foot forward, and some are downright hateful and uncharitable, but I’ve never understood the zeal with which some atheists impose their ideology. After all, if there is no God and no one is watching, what does it matter?
I don’t think many atheists would subscribe to that definition of religion, but your point is valid – without God, in what can we ground meaning, objective morality etc.
Oh no, I don’t think they would subscribe either! 🙂
They might not subscribe to that view, but they demonstrate it regardless. I was an atheist for ten years, I saw whst my fellow travelers did do and still do.
Also majority white population but they would never want to have that conversation…